A curated list of non-U.S.-based alternatives to popular services, focusing on privacy and global accessibility.
GitHub - anitwek/alternatives-to-us: A curated list of non-U.S.-based alternatives to popular services, focusing on privacy and global accessibility.
A curated list of non-U.S.-based alternatives to popular services, focusing on privacy and global accessibility. - anitwek/alternatives-to-usGitHub
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HowAbt2morrow
in reply to cyrano • • •calm.like.a.bomb
in reply to HowAbt2morrow • • •like this
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cyrano
in reply to HowAbt2morrow • • •metaStatic
in reply to HowAbt2morrow • • •like this
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Glide
in reply to metaStatic • • •like this
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AlexWIWA
in reply to Glide • • •Honse
in reply to Glide • • •Tldr is:
There is censorship baked into the model but because the weights are public, it can be removed /bypassed. In contrast the deepseek web app includes both kinds of censorship (and also definitely steals your data). The local model obviously does not.
teuto
in reply to Honse • • •My local version spat out this:
Of course, let me explain. In 1989, there were significant pro-democracy demonstrations in Beijing's Tiananmen Square, led primarily by students and other citizens advocating for reforms. The Chinese government, in response, took actions that resulted in a tragic loss of life and a strong suppression of the protests. It's a complex and sensitive topic in Chinese history. Do you have any specific aspects you'd like to discuss further?
Deepseek R1 is the least censored model that I've tried. It does a lot less of the "As an AI assistant, I can't help with unethical whatever" compared to the corporate approved US ones too.
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FaceDeer
in reply to teuto • • •Scary le Poo
in reply to teuto • • •Fwiw, chatgpt gave me a full historical account of the incident., after some prodding, so did deepseek local.
Deepseek local is easy to remove the guardrails though.
FaceDeer
in reply to Glide • • •ReversalHatchery
in reply to Glide • • •the spying, yes, if you make sure and apply a per-process whitelisting firewall on the system.
the biasing, no, that's in the model.
sunstoned
in reply to metaStatic • • •You're right, the server, cryptographic library, and all clients are open source.
That said, I have a few personal caveats.
GitHub - signalapp/Signal-Server: Server supporting the Signal Private Messenger applications on Android, Desktop, and iOS
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metaStatic
in reply to sunstoned • • •I was talking entirely about Deepseek.
I never would have bothered to check because someone already pointed out Signal is US based but that is very interesting.
so thank you.
ReversalHatchery
in reply to metaStatic • • •yhvr
in reply to ReversalHatchery • • •Tm12
in reply to cyrano • • •cyrano
in reply to Tm12 • • •Jessica
in reply to Tm12 • • •Creat
in reply to Jessica • • •VitoRobles
in reply to Creat • • •Because their CEO praises Trump?
I know you didn't say that I just wanted to point that out!
kambusha
in reply to cyrano • • •european-alternatives.eu/alter…
European alternatives for popular services | European Alternatives
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JOMusic
in reply to kambusha • • •Viri4thus
in reply to cyrano • • •qkall
in reply to Viri4thus • •Piracy: ꜱᴀɪʟ ᴛʜᴇ ʜɪɢʜ ꜱᴇᴀꜱ reshared this.
NuXCOM_90Percent
in reply to Viri4thus • • •They didn't "pay vassalage to trump". They spewed the same libertarian tech bro bullshit that most companies trying to cozy up to a new administration did. And the damage control responses align with that.
It isn't particularly good. But on the list of "privacy" corporations that are potentially honeypots, they still rank fairly low.
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ᥫ᭡ 𐑖ミꪜᴵ𝔦 ᥫ᭡
in reply to Viri4thus • • •weak argument, dismissed
There was a blog post by a website called Privacy Watchdog (if I remember correctly), I can't find that website anymore nor the blog post, it detailed the beginnings of Proton, and how almost every Proton team member used Gmail, and how so many of it's executives lived a few blocks away from CIA headquarters.. It also mentioned how Proton tried to censor PWD, and they removed many of their social media posts.. the website is taken down now.. And I can't find it.. But I'm certain it has "watchdog" in the name, I'm assuming 'privacy' is the first word, based on my memory
I think that Proton, is involved with.. let's say Organizations as bad as the CIA if not worse, I don't want to get political.. But take a look at their
... show moreweak argument, dismissed
There was a blog post by a website called Privacy Watchdog (if I remember correctly), I can't find that website anymore nor the blog post, it detailed the beginnings of Proton, and how almost every Proton team member used Gmail, and how so many of it's executives lived a few blocks away from CIA headquarters.. It also mentioned how Proton tried to censor PWD, and they removed many of their social media posts.. the website is taken down now.. And I can't find it.. But I'm certain it has "watchdog" in the name, I'm assuming 'privacy' is the first word, based on my memory
I think that Proton, is involved with.. let's say Organizations as bad as the CIA if not worse, I don't want to get political.. But take a look at their team members lists, first glance you'll think that all these people are independent professionals, They're not, I'll demonstrate by giving one name and you can do the same with the rest, Rosemary Leith (Board Member), take a look at her .. Bio, elevator pitch.. !! Whatever.. Now take a look at this, see something strange? they removed the part were it mentioned "she was the World Economic Forum Global Agenda Council Chair of the Future of Internet Security".. I hope people here aren't naive to think that one global government, or one centralized party that has influence over every government is going to save them from the injustices and abuses that their government lay upon them, if you understand that... congrats.. you'll understand why they removed that section, and you'll understand their true agenda.. uhm.. I mean direction..
again, I hope that's not too political..
Edit : found PWD website and added it
Edit 2 : I dismissed the Trump take because it's too short to even be counted as an argument, by my standards, hope you respect that, that being said.. I'm no Trump fanboy I know he's a liar and I don't care who's in office, as a long as They're team surveillance, I'm against that shit
Meet the team behind Proton | Proton
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NuXCOM_90Percent
in reply to ᥫ᭡ 𐑖ミꪜᴵ𝔦 ᥫ᭡ • • •Sorry, just to check: your evidence is "I think I read it somewhere?". If it weren't for "weak argument, dismissed" being too "cringe" even for ME...
If you have evidence, please actually provide it. If you don't, please shut your opinion hole.
And
That actually seems like a good background to have for working on software/products like this?
Also, people should actually LOOK at what proton "promises". Mostly it boils down to limited protections and suggested tools to protect yourself. Which is why, as a company, I like them. They aren't promising to fight all the governments of the world. In fact, they are pretty open that they are gonna roll over because they don't know you. But what they do claim to turn over? Combine that with some opsec and personal encryption and you are in a really "good" place for someone who has a warrant out on them.
Contrast that with all the companies that DO make wild claims about having zero
... show moreSorry, just to check: your evidence is "I think I read it somewhere?". If it weren't for "weak argument, dismissed" being too "cringe" even for ME...
If you have evidence, please actually provide it. If you don't, please shut your opinion hole.
And
That actually seems like a good background to have for working on software/products like this?
Also, people should actually LOOK at what proton "promises". Mostly it boils down to limited protections and suggested tools to protect yourself. Which is why, as a company, I like them. They aren't promising to fight all the governments of the world. In fact, they are pretty open that they are gonna roll over because they don't know you. But what they do claim to turn over? Combine that with some opsec and personal encryption and you are in a really "good" place for someone who has a warrant out on them.
Contrast that with all the companies that DO make wild claims about having zero data and being willing to go to nu-gitmo for their customers and blah blah blah.
The reality is: if you are doing something the CIA should care about, you... probably shouldn't be doing email at all. That said, there are ways to reduce your risk factor and they almost all boil down to communicating with trusted and vetted individuals where you can actually encrypt communications yourself rather than relying on a company to do so.
But if you are mostly just pirating shit or writing graphic lemons about threesomes involving trump, xinnie, and putin? Meh. You can do a lot worse.
ᥫ᭡ 𐑖ミꪜᴵ𝔦 ᥫ᭡
in reply to NuXCOM_90Percent • • •I'm not a US citizen, so unless you're going to make some good arguments about your US politics, until then.. I'm not obligated to listen or even care about your politics, if you're not giving me something I can use in future discussion with others, I'll dismiss what you say and treat it as noise.. As far as I know Proton replied to these Trump concerns and their reply seemed reasonable... But what do I know.. Lastly.. I'm not making any claims.. I'm just saying I'm not satisfied with that comment 🤨..
NuXCOM_90Percent
in reply to ᥫ᭡ 𐑖ミꪜᴵ𝔦 ᥫ᭡ • • •I am not making arguments for US politics. I am not here to give you "something (you) can use in future discussion with others"
I am telling you that you have no evidence whatsoever but you are spewing bullshit. You are just as bad as trump making up bullshit about how he read a report that nuking a hurricane would solve all problems. Your argument is literally "I think I heard somewhere"
We are all scared. We are all trying to protect ourselves. Maybe you can be an ally instead of an agitator, hmm?
ᥫ᭡ 𐑖ミꪜᴵ𝔦 ᥫ᭡
in reply to NuXCOM_90Percent • • •You have a problem with my Proton critism or me not being satisfied with the Trump argument ? why you're mixing the two ?
I didn't say I heard somewhere... ever.. go back and read... slowly this time
NuXCOM_90Percent
in reply to ᥫ᭡ 𐑖ミꪜᴵ𝔦 ᥫ᭡ • • •Yeah. And trump totally read an article somewhere that black trans people are the root of all evil. He can't find it right now, but totally trust him on that.
I don't know if you are just this stupid or if you are actually trying to undermine those who are trying to make educated decisions on what they should or should not "trust" communication wise (you'll note that I all but say "don't trust proton. protect yourself").
But either find that mystery article so that people can make educated decisions or shut the fuck up.
ᥫ᭡ 𐑖ミꪜᴵ𝔦 ᥫ᭡
in reply to NuXCOM_90Percent • • •I thought so, you seem to think I'm a Trump fanboy 🤦♂️, you're very mistaken
If you actually gave a damn about making educated guesses that piece of info should have been all you need to find that article, but you're here to start shit, you want me as an ally, your tone lost me.. maybe you should work on that first
The Truth About Protonmail – Privacy Watchdog
web.archive.orgNuXCOM_90Percent
in reply to ᥫ᭡ 𐑖ミꪜᴵ𝔦 ᥫ᭡ • • •Ah. Thank you for actually finally citing yourself.
I actually HAD seen that before so:
- .Protonmail Behaves like a CIA/NSA “Honeypot”: This is an incredibly sensationalized point that boils down to them having a really shit TOR page. And, agreed. But "In fact, the only other websites that operate like this are suspected NSA/CIA Honeypots." is very much false. LOTS of sites are configured in a really shitty manner which gets back to people having to understand the tools they use.
- Protonmail Does Not Provide “End to End Encryption”: Yeah. Which gets back to what I have been saying the entire time. If you actually care about your security, encrypt your own emails. Nobody should EVER trust a company to do encryption for them when it actually matters. Which speaks to the quality of proton as a service, not it being a "honeypot"
- . Protonmail’s Was Created Under CIA/NSA Oversight: That article is almost entirely them just repeating that same inflammatory statement over and over. But it boils down to having issues with somethi
... show moreAh. Thank you for actually finally citing yourself.
I actually HAD seen that before so:
You see, when you actually post a link to stuff people can discuss what you are talking about and explain why you are misinformed and clearly referencing a somewhat deranged hit piece.
The main takeaway from that? They are, at worst, as bad as gmail. Except with a much smaller customer base and at least more open that they want you to pay for functionality rather than not question what google is doing with your data.
And, as proton themselves even say: if it actually matters, encrypt your own emails. That way Proton Corp don't have anything they can give to their CIA/Mossad/Swiss overlords.
If the only way you care about people protecting their privacy and very selfs is if someone is nice to you and cuddles you and thanks you for spewing uncited nonsense...
ᥫ᭡ 𐑖ミꪜᴵ𝔦 ᥫ᭡
in reply to NuXCOM_90Percent • • •You and i both know it wasn't the citation (or the lack of) that caused you to use that language..
vastard
in reply to Viri4thus • • •Goodtoknow
in reply to cyrano • • •GrumpyDuckling
in reply to Goodtoknow • • •Shirogane Ryu
in reply to GrumpyDuckling • • •Canadian_Cabinet
in reply to cyrano • • •morgin
in reply to Canadian_Cabinet • • •Queen HawlSera
in reply to cyrano • • •fin
in reply to cyrano • • •Rakuten is very privacy invasive imo
Ulrich
in reply to cyrano • • •Where do I even start with this?
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Natanox
in reply to Ulrich • • •All three browsers recommended are Chromium-based as well, so they're dependent on Google and have to suffer from the Manifest v3 problem and the necessary manual intervention. Brave even is known for being maintained by a dick. Some of those recommendations are really bad.
Don't get your second question though. The reasons for non-US should be obvious.
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Ulrich
in reply to Natanox • • •Well they're obviously not so maybe you can enlighten me.
floquant
in reply to Ulrich • • •You know how Americans think Chinese and Russian services are bad because of their government's use of user data?
It's the same for us non-americans with American platforms. All the "anti-terror" laws have made them a privacy nightmare
Zoidsberg
in reply to Ulrich • • •Kilgore Trout
in reply to cyrano • • •Rookwood
in reply to cyrano • • •