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in reply to Raglan Niall

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Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

@Niall @neurotropic @Noxie That video is an absolute disgrace and I'm quite frankly surprised it's still up given how much flag he got for it. Given how non-existent his attempt at looking at the game was I have to assume it's ragebait.

He basically recommended scraping 90% of the game world and going back to game design concepts from the 90's, based on an understanding of the game that was so obviously limited to the initial spawn area and quite frankly ideologically tainted.

@neurotropic @Raglan Niall @Noxie
in reply to Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

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Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

@Niall @neurotropic @Noxie Sorry for the sudden outburst. He often got a lot of good points, but this time he really stuck is whole arm all the way into the toilet. Given it's so bad it's probably ragebait I wonder how much of his channel is actually serious or just a stunt. Or if he's really that dense.
@neurotropic @Raglan Niall @Noxie
in reply to Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

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neurotropic

@Natanox @Niall @Noxie the video is a little long and meanders, so I assume a bit of ragebaiting going on. Haven't played it myself (not enough time) but I do remember from my teenage years the issue of "transportation time" in some RPGs. A city map was dense and interesting to explore, and then you had to go smwh else, which meant walking through forests or wastelands ... for a while. later, you might get the option of quick travel after you visited place y for the first time.
@Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸 @Raglan Niall @Noxie
in reply to neurotropic

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Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

@neurotropic @Niall @Noxie Cyberpunk doesn't really have this issue, they have an instant transit system (point-to-point on the map) + car summoning, and later added the transit system they skipped earlier to finish production. It's a good in-between of having to drive everywhere in an increasingly boring world (as you completed all side-missions and events) and insta-travel like in Skyrim where you honestly completely skip the whole world and any chance of immersion or surprise.
@neurotropic @Raglan Niall @Noxie
in reply to Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

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Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

@neurotropic @Niall @Noxie It's not even like Night City isn't pedestrian-friendly. On the contrary even, it's more pedestrian-friendly than most US cities today despite still being even more dystopian. Adam just never looked at the game beyond the spawn area (let alone the existing lore), yet had the audacity to tell the devs how they supposedly screwed up the games' design because he so desperately wants to paint a certain picture. Instead he makes himself look like a clown.
@neurotropic @Raglan Niall @Noxie
in reply to Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

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Frederico Machuca

@Natanox @neurotropic @Niall @Noxie i’ve played through the whole game + phantom liberty and I 100% agree with the video’s point that designing 2077 with a car centric lens made it a worse overall experience to the player.

the fact that night city still manages to be more friendly than certain US cities just further proves the point.

@neurotropic @Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸 @Raglan Niall @Noxie
in reply to Frederico Machuca

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Noxie

@fremachuca The scale made it impossible to flesh out everything to a good standard, but it had to be car centric, it's not a choice it's the base material. If you don't want cars geralt of rivia is there for you =3. I'm not saying it doesn't kill the vibe of NC, but still it's an integrant part of NC, Maybe they could've sized it down a bit and play with having more cars and detritus on the roads to force a slower car travel and encourage the subway. @Natanox @neurotropic @Niall @cmconseils
@Lady Laura @neurotropic @Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸 @Frederico Machuca @Raglan Niall
in reply to Noxie

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Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

@Noxie @fremachuca @neurotropic @Niall They would've been mocked relentlessly if they deviated from the source material and, instead of leaning into the Cyberpunk dystopia (which very much is car-dependent with only trashy public transport at best) went somewhere else.

Not sure where Frederico goes with that argument, but the fact even Cyberpunk is still more pedestrian-friendly than US cities means they already didn't go all-in.

The only place it felt "off" was Dogtown.

@neurotropic @Frederico Machuca @Raglan Niall @Noxie
in reply to Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

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Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

@Noxie @fremachuca @neurotropic @Niall In general the original plan was for movement to look differently. They didn't just delay the trains, they completely scraped the idea of vertical movement (you were supposed to be able to climb walls with e.g. the Mantis Blades) which is a thing in the TTG, I think Cyberpunk Red or 2020. And it isn't even that they wouldn't have done it in a DLC… but the tech didn't allow it afaik. They've built themselves into a messy, badly documented corner.
@neurotropic @Frederico Machuca @Raglan Niall @Noxie
in reply to Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸

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Noxie

@Natanox First line (pretty much) is about the rule of cool, of course you can climb with your blades =3, fuck even if you had an improved mouth suction mouth ware any reasonable dm would allow it to have a bonus in climbing xD Dogtown was bombed to shit so cars are mostly unable to navigate from what I know from the lore. There's still imo a bit too much car, but I would assume BARGHEST had an interest in cleaning out roads to allow for their goons to move around and maintain control.

but IMO CDPR did a bang up job respecting the base material, their own lore additions are pretty much indistinguishable from RTal, I have talked with Pondsmith thanks to Night Crew and he said very clearly that CDPR + RTal had multiple meetings a week to discuss every aspect, from the road width to dolls implants. So yeah not the most ideal gameplay but it was on purpose because lore. The only issue was the very rushed released that made so that the metro and autopilots were not available at launch (+ the bugs on lower configs)

@fremachuca @neurotropic @Niall @cmconseils

@Lady Laura @neurotropic @Natanox 🇺🇦🇵🇸 @Frederico Machuca @Raglan Niall
in reply to Lady Laura

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lothar

Creator of Sim City in an interview:

> When I started measuring out our local grocery store, which I don’t think of as being that big, I was blown away by how much more space was parking lot rather than actual store. ... we quickly realized there were way too many parking lots in the real world and that our game was going to be really boring if it was proportional in terms of parking lots.

> We do have parking lots in the game, and we do try to scale them—

1/2

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